Hidden and intermediate states of nucleons

by
U.V.S. Seshavatharam
DIP QA Engineer, Lanco Industries Ltd, Srikalahasti-517641, A.P, India
E-mail: seshavatharam.uvs@gmail.com

Prof. S. LAKSHMINARAYANA
Department Of Nuclear Physics, Andhra University, Vizag-530003, AP, India.
E-mail: lnsrirama@yahoo.com


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Abstract
Nuclear planck energy is given by

where Gs is the strong nuclear gravitational constant [1, 2, 3] and is equal to N²Gc.
Here N is Avagadro number and GC is the classical gravitational constant.
In the previous paper [1] it is suggested that there exists 2 kinds of mass units.

They are observed and hidden mass units and their mass ratio is XE = 295.0606338.
XE can be called as the lepton-quark mass generator [1 – 4].
In this paper this idea is applied to the nucleons.

Hidden mass unit of nucleon can be given as

It is noticed that there exists an intermediate hidden mass state in between neutron and proton.
If nuclear stability factor is defined as

hidden mass of the intermediate state can be given as

Observable mass of this hidden intermediate state can be given as

If mec² is the rest energy of electron, this observable intermediate state gains a mass-energy of ½mec²  and transforms to neutron.
By loosing a mass-energy of 2mec²  transforms to proton.

Error is related with

Here Ec and Ea are the semi emepirical mass formula [1, 3, 15, 16, 17] coulomb and asymmetry energy constants.
Finally it is suggested that pairing energy constant of the semi empirical mass formula is

Asymmetry energy constant

Ec, Ea are related with XE as

Volume and surface energy constants are related as

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346 comments to Hidden and intermediate states of nucleons

  • Zero

    Dear Mr. Rossi,
    You stated that you believe that the nickle to copper transmutation is a side effect of the process. With your knowledge of the process and experience with the reactions, do you believe it is possible to alter the process to have the transmutation of materials as the main goal?

    Thank you,

    -Zero

  • Steven N. Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    You stated that after 6 months of eCat operation you did not see elevated levels of Deuterium. Using Storm’s Student Guide, it appears the next output product might be Helium. This would be accomplished by various fusion pairs of Hydrogen, Deuterium and Tritium (generated and then consumed). The average energy per pair to Helium is around 25 MeV. So it appears that 0.2 grams of Helium should be in the hydrogen gas after 6 months of continuous operation. This should be a detectable level.

    1. Have you observed excess Helium in your eCats after 6 months of operation?
    2. If not, is the composition of the walls of the eCat porous/diffuse to Helium?

  • Steven N. Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    The important focus for marine and train locomotion is electricity generation. Just as diesel-electric engines used in trains generate electricity, then motors move the wheels, so Hot eCat technology may be able to provide the electricity in large quantities, in a relatively small volume to drive the electric motors on trains and to power marine applications.

    So you are correct to focus on electricity generation – all the subsequent applications using that electricity will “flow” (pun intended)

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Steven N. Karels:
    Better focus on electric power production, now. The tests with the Hot Cato are going on very, very well. The day after tomorrow the Hot Cat will have a very important measurement, with a new system. If things will go well, an important step forward will have been done.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Steven N. Karels:
    1- yes
    2- no
    3- the amount of Copper, after more than 2 years now of tests and measurements, analysis, etc, is very low, so we know now it is a side effect. The energy comes from other nuclear effects that we have understood. We have a precise theory now.
    The isotopic distribution will also be disclosed with the theory.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Steven N. Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    From a couple of my previous postings, I suggested how much Hydrogen was consumed in six months of operation and, assuming it went to Deuterium, how much would have been generated. When you have done your six months operation eCat testing:

    1. Have you tested the residual gas content of an eCat?
    2. Have you detected Deuterium in elevated levels?
    3. Have you detected a measurable increase in the presence of Copper and, if so, what were the isotropic distributions of Nickel and Copper after 6 months?

  • Steven N. Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    Another exotic application might be electricity generation for locomotive (train) and for marine ship propulsion. Maybe a surface application will not make you feel “Up in the air”?

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Herb Gills:
    Impossible, for safety reasons.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Steven N. Karels:
    I prefer to fly down…and focus on the electric power.
    Warmest Regards,
    A.R.

  • Steven N. Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    Another, longer-term, more exotic usage for Hot eCats would be long distance jet propulsion. The modern jet airliner or transport aircraft uses a greater rate of fuel consumption during takeoff and to a lesser extent during landings compared to cruise fuel consumption rates. But most of the needed thrust during the long in-flight travel is at a relatively low setting. This is characterized by long duration flight time at a steady power output. Just the case for the Hot eCat. According to Wikipedia, the modern turbine blades see around 1300 C temperatures although earlier version were around 820 C. So a Hot eCat seems to be in the right temperature range.

    Consider an aircraft with a second set of jet engines on the aircraft and these engines were not used during landing or take-offs? These would be Hot eCat powered engines that are activated at altitude and cruise speed. The aerodynamic design of these Hot eCat engines could be optimized for a given altitude and air speed. Conventional jet engines must be made to work at all different altitudes and speeds (within the operating regions). The regular engines could be throttled back or turned off during the cruise portion of the flight. You would only run out of Hot eCat fuel after 6 months — other consummables would be exhausted first (e.g., food, water, lubrication, etc). While this might not make sense for short trips, it certainly would be desirable for trans-ocean flights.

  • herb gillis

    Andrea Rossi:
    During the conference you said that you observed neutrons when running some experiments around 200 COP. As an alternative to limiting COP to only 6, would it perhaps be better for centralized power production (where everything can be heavily shielded) to work at the higher COP and use a strong neutron absorber (such as Boron-10) to absorb the neutrons? This would add to the overall energy yield because of the neutron – boron reaction [B10 + n = He4 + Li7], which is highly exothermic.
    Regards; HRG.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear4 Prof. Joseph Fine:
    Thank you,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Joseph Fine

    Andrea Rossi & Readers:

    Here are some interesting links on the subject of using low temperatures for desalination. That is, temperatures which can be produced by the Industrial E-Cat and probably by quantities of residential versions of the E-Cat (House Cat?).

    The individual behind these desalination advances is Professor Kam K. Sirkar of NJIT.

    I am re-posting this article from Scientifc American to have the material in one place.

    http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=desalination-membrane-tech

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pM7ed6VdSrU&feature=youtube_gdata_player

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdTaSrtoqBQ

    http://articles.economictimes.indiatimes.com/2012-06-05/news/32055849_1_desalination-reverse-osmosis-drinking-water

    Desalination Regards,

    Joseph Fine

  • Robert Curto

    Dear Daniel, thanks for the excellent information.
    You explained the advantage of E-cats very well.

    Robert Curto

  • g.Luca from Italy

    Caro A.
    ieri sono stato in visita presso una società che utilizza, per la propria produzione, una quantità di energia elettrica tale che, se le cose non cambieranno nei prossimi mesi (cosa praticamente impossibile con le fonti energetiche attuali) saranno costretti a trasferire la produzione in Germania, dove il KWh costa il 45% in meno che in Italia.
    La problematica è ormai all’ordine del giorno sulle cronache economiche e sociali.
    L’Italia, più di ogni altro paese industrializzato, ha bisogno delle LENR.
    Fate in fretta.
    Saluti

  • Guru

    Pure try and error speculative suggestion:

    Secret charge is inside small sealed torus, O.K.
    I suggest divided perimeter of torus into sections about 6 mm, and every fourth section inside the perimeter wall (inside side of wall of small torus) doing highly polished for purpose of reflection of photons back.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Joe:
    We do not give this kind of information,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Joe

    Dr Rossi,

    Does the strong interaction play a greater role in the Hot Cat than it does in the E-Cat?

    All the best,
    Joe

  • @Robert Curto,

    At the moment and in Europe, renewable and variable energy sources (like wind-farms and solar cells) co-operate with gas-powered power-stations. (The gas powered stations take over the electricity production in case there’s no wind or sun). But here (and in the near future) comes in the big advantage of the (Hot) E-cats: As the E-cats can be started up in one hour, and be turned down in one hour, they certainly could co-operate with variable wind-farms and solar cells. (Based on the prediction and measurements of wind and weather, and on weather forecasts, we could quickly start up the necessary amount of Hot E-cats, to produce the electrical power that the wind and the sun fail to deliver, and this the E-cats do much quicker than gas powered plants (because they can be started up and turned down in 1 hour), and they also are more flexible (if they are switched on and of per 10kw module or even per 1MW unit) and cheaper (COP = 6, so the gas driven Hot E-cat plants produce electricity at a much lower cost than the ordinary gas-powered power-stations… 😉

    But of course, I know that the industrial E-cats (as well E-cat and Hot E-cat) also are very good for many industrial clients themselves (producing as well thermal energy (E-cat and Hot E-cat) as electricity (in the future with Hot E-cat)). And yes, compared with gas-powered power stations, the gas-driven Hot E-cats consume less primary energy (in this case gas) than the ordinary gas powered power stations, and certainly they gradually will take a growing share in the energy-mix, but I don’t think they will replace everything immediately. (There always will be an energy-mix of different energy sources, and being able to co-operate easily with renewable energy sources is a very strong point of the E-cats!)

    Kind Regards,

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Joe:
    No,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Robert Curto

    Dear Dr. Rossi, they are going to spend 3.5 BILLION dollars to build a transmission line to bring wind energy generated in Oklahoma to Tennessee.

    How about building an E-Cat Plant in Tennessee or in any State that needs energy,
    with zero transmission line cost.

    If you want to read the details Google:
    3.5 billion to build a transmission line

    Robert Curto
    Ft. Lauderdale, Flordia
    USA

  • Joe

    Dr Rossi,

    Do isomeric transitions play a greater role in the Hot Cat than they do in the E-Cat?

    All the best,
    Joe

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Gio:
    Salvis juribus!
    Warm Regards
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Steven N. Karels:
    Yes.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Ecco Liberation:
    Thank you for your suggestions,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Ecco Liberation

    Congratulations on simplifying the experimental setup, dott. Andrea Rossi. The ideal thing, for the sake of testing, would be stripping down the reactor to the bare minimum needed to obtain a strongly observable excess heat effect. In that regard, at this point I’m wondering if a cylindrical reactor shape is actually needed. I was thinking that (depending on reactor details I might not be aware of) you could use a “sandwich” construction, that is, a flat resistance (including the active charge) between two flat steel sheets. Even better, if you could get rid of the heating resistance by applying current directly to the steel enclosing (external heating would probably be a better idea, but it would make the experimental setup more complex).

    But I’m just thinking aloud.
    Ecco

  • Steven N. Karels

    eCat and Control Linearity

    The eCat technology is an interesting and not fully explained heat generation capability. The term COP or Coefficient of Performance implies a linear relationship between input power (e.g., electrical) and output thermal power. But from certain comments made by Andrea Rossi, this may not be the case. What do we know? Applying a certain amount of electrical power heats the eCat from start-up temperature and the temperature increases in accordance with normal heat capacity and heat transfer laws of physics. At some temperature, the Nickel-Hydrogen “fuel” ignites and excess heat is generated. Rossi has reported a COP of 6 can typically be observed. He has also reported a self-sustaining mode where virtually no electrical power is input to keep the reaction going. Self-sustaining operation is further reported to last for some period of time (minutes to hours) and then the thermal power output decreases unless additional electrical input power is applied.

    It is desirable to have a linear control of a heat generation system. This allows a change in output thermal power as the load demand changes. Is there an operating regime where the eCat demonstrates linear control response? It has been stated that the possibility of thermal run-away is nil because the reaction stops at the melting point of nickel. But this also destroys the “fuel”. Ideally, if there were a region on the response curve (thermal output power vs electrical input power) that was reasonably linear, a control system could be implemented to regulate and control the thermal output. This may not be the case.

    In ensemble systems such as the Industrial 1 MW eCat where approximately 100 10kW eCats are combined, it should be possible to turn on and off individual units to control the ensemble output. An intelligent control system could also keep track of individual eCat modules lifetime generation history to ensure maximum time between needing to replace spent eCat modules.

    So does COP imply control linearity? Perhaps Andrea Rossi will illumine us?

  • gio

    Dear Ing. rossi

    i read your capital letters – precisations.
    Sincerely , i have no doubt about it.

    Salvis iuribus :):)

    Rinnovata cordialità

    gio

  • Andrea Rossi

    DEAR GIO:
    I WANT TO ADD THAT SO FAR THE MEASUREMENTS MADE BY NEW SYSTEMS HAVE CONFIRMED, SUBSTANTIALLY, THE DATA PRESENTED IN THE REPORT OF ZURICH. IN PARTICULAR: WE HAVE ELIMINATED THE INTERNAL CYLINDER, TO MAKE EASIER THE MEASUREMENT OF THE ENERGY, BEING NOW ALL THE ENERGY EMITTED THROUGH THE EXTERNAL CYLINDER SURFACE, AND WE ARE USING A VARIAC INSTEAD OF A TRIAC, TOGETHER WITH CERTIFIED INSTRUMENTATION.
    NEVERTHELESS, MORE MEASUREMENTS ARE CARRIED ON BY THE VALIDATORS TEAM.
    WARM REGARDS,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Gio:
    If the tests we are making on the reactors at high temperatures will confirm the validation of these devices, the application of the hot cats to cars could be possible, but you must consider that to get the necessary certifications in this sector will take many years, honestly I do not imagine how many years.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • gio

    dear ing. rossi

    i would like to know your opinion about the use of ecat as car engine, in the future …in the next 20 or 30 years;or maybe earlier:)

    What kind of e-cat do you think coul be the most useful for car engine: ecat fueled by electricity , by gas ,bi fueled..?

    What’s your vision?

    cordialità

    gio

  • Leena Peters

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    Even if you cannot unveil the inner secrets of the Hot-Cat at least we can speculate. We know from the thermographic imaging that the surface temperature of the outer cylinder is fairly even, about 800C. Due to the fairly poor heat conductivity of ceramics that means that the heat must be produced fairly close to the inner surface of the outer tube, otherwise the ceramic would be destroyed. This is exactly how the bobbin that carries the heating spirals is designed. But, as I just proved, the anomalous heat must be produced in the same volume as the regular electric heat. So then I came to think of Francesco Celani’s recent demonstration of anomalous heat generation. He uses a specially prepared but still rather standard wire for electric heating. Take for instance Nikrothal 80, it contains 80% Nickel that could be fused with Hydrogen! At the elevated temperatures inside the Hot-Cat the catalyzer(s) that break up the hydrogen-hydrogen bonds could not be a chemical compound, it would break up. I imagine that the elementary catalyzer(s) and the hydrogen could be stored in the ceramic body itself, not in a sealed chamber. When the electric heating is turned on the ceramic starts releasing Hydrogen that already before leaving the ceramic is made mono atomic by the catalyzer(s). The Hydrogen atoms penetrate into the nearby red hot heating wires where they fuse with Nickel atoms and anomalous heat is generated.

    Best regards, Leena Peters

  • Wladimir Guglinski

    Herb Gillis wrote in September 14th, 2012 at 5:28 PM

    Wladimir Guglinski:
    Thanks for your comments and the link to the magnetic engine video. I had not heard of this before, and find it quite surprising. The obvious question is why is this not in wide spread use? Are you convinced it is real? It sounds “too good to be true” at face value, much like the Ecat. But the Ecat seems (or seemed) to have an explanation based on “accepted” science. Whats the catch?”

    Guru wrote in September 15th, 2012 at 4:05 AM

    Dear Wladimir, guy at video (of your provided link) has very strong Czech accent. Energy is provided from hidden small battery (hidden under tape in fourth corner) via shortened (not removed) vires. Czech folks love jokes and “knedlo-vepro-zelo”. I too.”

    Dear Guru and Herb Gillis

    there are real magnetic motors working.

    http://bedinimotors.blogspot.com.br/

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgpE7D6yywo&feature=fvwrel

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jih_ino2LDo&feature=related

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HuyDutRcNDY&feature=rellist&playnext=1&list=PL64F791FE951986BB

    Unfortunatelly some guys use to put jokes in the internet, and their objective is to descredit the serious reasearch on the field of magnetic motors.

    Those guys make the same thing made by the snakes who try to descredit Rossi’s eCat.

    regards
    WLAD

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Pekka Janhunen:
    Yes, you are right, but what you say returns to electric power production, with which you can do whatever you want. My thought was more specific, but was wrong.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Bernie Koppenhofer:
    I agree,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Bernie Koppenhofer

    Mr. Rossi: Desalination: I have to agree with you. The Hot Cat and electric power is the ultimate solution. Then, Mining the brine might also help.

  • Dear Andrea,
    However cheap desalinated water produced by reverse osmos or other technique is, desalination is not an option for people living far from the ocean, unless large water pipeline systems are built which pump desalinated water into inlands. The latter is unlikely to happen soon in corrupt and poor countries. For people living far from the ocean (the majority), only traditional methods are applicable (lakes, rivers, wells etc.), OR condensation of water from the atmosphere. Condensation from the atmosphere is too energy intensive with current energy prices, but it might become viable with E-cat energy.

    Generally speaking, any method of producing potable water needs energy, and if E-cat is the most economical way of producing said energy, it has a market and people get water. I’m a bit troubled by your comment that you cannot compete against reverse osmosis, because it feels as if one is then mixing two separate questions: (1) from which feedstock (ocean, river, atmosphere etc.) and how to produce potable water and (2) how to produce the energy needed to do it. As I see it, E-cat’s domain is question number (2) only. The answers to (1) will anyway depend on local conditions so that different solutios must be used in different regions.
    regards, pekka

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Pekka Janhunen:
    We are honestly thinking, after due diligence, that it will be impossible to compete against reverse osmosis, which costs 1 $/1000 liters: we will never reach this target , unless something really revolutionary comes up. Anyway we now are focused on the electric power consumption.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Jim Rice:
    1- we made it : we call it the “dummy test”
    2- There is not necessity of it to measure the COP.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Joe:
    Confidential,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Joe

    Dr Rossi,

    Would the Hot Cat be a dangerous device if Hf were adapted to it rather than Ni?

    All the best,
    Joe

  • Jim Rice

    Dear Dr. Rossi:

    I believe I was the last person to get a picture with you during the conference, as my girlfriend and I assaulted you as you left the auditorium to catch your flight, and you were kind enough to pose with me for a photo. Thank you very much, the picture is on my wall now.

    I had two questions that I didn’t get a chance to ask related to what effect is caused by the input electricity and what is caused by the active nickel charge:

    1. Regarding the Hot Cat report, why not include a control version which has no active charge. Then conduct the experiment exactly as before and compare the results to the version with the active charge. The difference must then be a result of the presence or absence of the charge.

    2. I know you are averse to having a self-sustaining E-Cat for safety certification reasons. But a self-sustaining version (cool cat or hot cat) that operates on its own for long periods would definitively answer the question of whether there is an overall gain in energy (cop > 1) for the device, and so whether the LENR effect is real.

    Sincerely,

    Jim Rice

  • Dear Andrea,
    A 10 kW heat source could purify by boiling and condensation 430 liters in 24 hours, which is enough water for 3 average consuming Finns (2 MJ/kg heat of evaporation).

    Instead of using seawater, one could also condense water from the atmosphere. The atmospheric method would work everywhere and it is residue-free. The energy consumption would be less (by factor 3-4, perhaps) than in direct boiling because one can use a E-cat powered heatpump to make a cool surface where water condenses. Such condenser might be an add-on option of a future E-cat model which can provide heating, cooling and electricity. The high-temp end of the heatpump could evaporate the same amount of wastewater back into atmosphere. The solid residue might perhaps be treated by pyrolysis provided by the HotCat’s heat… This kind of scheme would approach a per-household closed circulation of water which leaves no residues and doesn’t change the atmospheric humidity.
    regards, pekka

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Pekka:
    We are not competitive, so far. Not at all, honestly.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Dear Leena Peters:
    I am very sorry, but the answer to your question is, for obvious reasons, confidential.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Leena Peters

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    Yesterday you wrote about the Hot-Cat:

    “Dear Sven Gudmundsson:
    The charge is inside the toroidal section, but in a sealed room. The putty has nothing to do.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.”

    I have looked carefully at the pictures of the internal parts of the Hot-Cat. The two corderite bobbins seem to pretty much standard. They are solid ceramic bodies designed to heat a tube from the inside. Where is the space for the “sealed room” that contains the fuel?

    Best regards, Leena Peters

  • Dear Andrea Rossi,
    Some data on desalination (http://www.desware.net/desa4.aspx): “Theoretically, about 0.86 kWh of energy is needed to desalinate 1 m3 of salt water… The present day desalination plants use 5 to 26 times as much as this theoretical minimum depending on the type of process used. Clearly, it is necessary to make desalination processes as energy-efficient as possible through improvements in technology and economies of scale.”

    In Finland where fresh water in common, people consume an average of 155 liters per day. Using the above data, producing this by desalination would thus need 28 to 140 W of continuous power per person, depending on technology. For all 7 billion people it would be 0.2 to 1 TW: a large power, but only a few percent of the world’d total energy consumption which is 14 TW (equivalent to 2 kW continuous per person).

    It seems that energy is only part of the bottleneck in providing clean water for everyone. That said, cheap energy would certainly help, directly and also indirectly by raising the general standard of living in the world. One 10 kW E-cat makes enough power to desalinate water for 100-500 persons.

    Overall I agree with Markus K.: it’s best for Leonardo to concentrate on the E-cat itself and deal with applications mainly through partnerships and B2B.

    (Disclaimer: I have no specific knowledge of desalination. I was just digging up numbers and multiplying them.)
    regards, pekka

  • Italo R.

    @ Herb Gillis:

    Obviously there must be a trick. One possible explanation is using an hidden little battery covered by the black tape and a proximity switch actuated by one of the magnets

  • Guru

    Dear Wladimir, guy at video (of your provided link) has very strong Czech accent. Energy is provided from hidden small battery (hidden under tape in fourth corner) via shortened (not removed) vires. Czech folks love jokes and “knedlo-vepro-zelo”. I too.

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