United States Patent US 9,115,913 B1

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36,424 comments to United States Patent US 9,115,913 B1

  • Horst Dieter Preschel

    @Matthias
    The english translation for ‘Balkonkraftwerk’ is either balcony power plant or balcony power station.
    I agree the ecat SKLep would be a good solution for a balcony power plant. But it is a little bit more complicated.
    If you like to discuss send me a message, just ‘google’ my name.
    Regards
    Horst Dieter Preschel

  • Steven Nicholes Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    Looking into my “Crystal Ball” and the future. If the Ecat SKLep is successful (meets specs and is commercially viable), then it could be used within homes to meet the electrical needs of the home with excess energy flowing back into the electrical grid.

    As more and more homes become energy independent and energy providers, some form of electrical grid control will be required to diminish the amount of excess energy flowing back into the electrical grid. As the demands of the electrical increase and decrease, some form of system control will need to be implemented.

    Since you have stated the lifetime of the SKLep is not the amount of energy it produces but the amount of operating time, would it not be wise to develop a local network controller to accept requests from the electrical grid to reduce or increase the amount of energy flowing into the home or from the home? This controller would need to turn off or on specific unit(s) to meet the energy requirements while maximizing the remaining operating time of the individual SKLep units.

    For example, the controller would not always turn on or off unit #1 while allowing the other units to continue. Would it not be better to distribute the operating time of all SKLep units controlled by the local controller?

  • Andrea Rossi

    Matthias:
    We must make a distinction: one thing is the Ecat’s plug to the grid, another is the load connected to the Ecat.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    A. Heinzmann:
    Thank you for your opinion,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Mody:
    As you know, we made the safety certifications. The Ecats will be delivered with the data of the certification in the label.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Gerson:
    The answer is complex and depends on the specific situations. In general, the modules can be connected in series and parallels, the power source schematic depends from the specific application,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Gerson

    Dear Mr. Rossi,
    you asked for detailed meaning of my question,
    if the primary and secondary side of the device are galvanically coupled.
    What I meant was:
    When I am feeding the input of the unit (primary side) with about 1W, applying a voltage there,
    is the output of the device completely independent from this input and I can combine the ouputs of many devices
    in series (or maybe even in parallel) without having to care for the input voltage reference (GND).
    Thanks!
    Best Regards
    Gerson

  • Mody

    Dr Rossi,
    When will you publish the Ecat safety certification ?
    Best,
    Mody

  • A.Heinzmann

    Dear Mr. Rossi,
    to be realistic: If the ecat really works as you describe and the test shows us, you do not have to fear competitors.
    In the start of such a new product the demand is high, every replication could be even more expensive than your original if it has say just 6 month delivery time instead of say 18 month delivery time by Leonardo.
    And this condition of the market will be last many years, simply because the setup of production facilities won’t keep pace with the market demand.
    Best regards
    A.Heinzmann

  • Matthias

    Dear Dr. Rossi,
    i know you wrote that an ecat of 100 Watt will shut off if there will be an electrical overload of f.e. 110 Watt or more.
    Therefore i cannot just plug in the ecat to the mains like a “Balkonkraftwerk” – i do not know the english word for it, in germany it is allowed to plug in up to 600 Watt PV straight to the wall socket. Then at first the power of the PV will be used and all what is above the production of the PV comes from the grid.
    If this would be possible for an ecat you would have immediately the breakthrough in the market.
    Best regards
    Matthias

  • Andrea Rossi

    Daniel G. Zavela:
    1- I don’t know and never underestimate a competitor
    2- I hope so
    3- It is a complex issue
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Steve:
    Thank you for your suggestion,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Jimbo:
    Yes, the safety certification has been done. The safety certification process does not depend on the theoretical supposed bases of the technology.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Claus Buerger:
    It depends on the specific situation.
    As I already explained, we will give assistance for specific applications when we will deliver the preordered units,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Gerson:
    1- what do you mean with “primary and secondary side” ?
    2a- aging material
    2b- 100000 hours mean s of operation
    2c- no, the lifespan does not depend on the power, only on the operational time
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Gerson

    Dear Mr. Rossi,
    am very impressed with you answering those many questions very patiently and wise by yourself!
    And I’m finding the 1./2./3. style the most effective ;).
    1.) Are the primary and secondary side of the 100W unit galvanically connected (e.g. GND to GND)
    or completely independent?
    2.) The expected life of the unit of about 100,000 hours:
    2a.) Is it just the material getting older that makes the limit, or the power capability that is reached then?
    Questions behind the question:
    2b.) If I use the unit only half the time, will it absolutely live for 200,000 hours?
    2c.) If I use the unit with only a load of 25W will it be working 400,000 hours?
    Many thanks for your answers.
    Will help me to better think of applications (electrical engineer)
    Best Regards
    Gerson

  • Dear Dr. Rossi,
    thank you!

    Questions:

    A) To mitigate the electricity bill of my apartment, can I simply – as an example – connect 10 Ecats with 230V AC output in parallel via a multiple socket to the apartment power grid?

    B) If A) is true, does this also work when the power grid fails, so to speak in island mode or does the ecat nead an existing 230V supply.

    C) If B) is true: If I now take out the main fuse, could I then supply the entire apartment by connecting 10 parallel-connected Ecats with 230V AC output to several sockets each?

    D) Does this mean that the Ecat 230V AC output automatically synchronizes with the mains and then functions like a generator?

  • Jimbo

    Dr Rossi,
    Have the safety certifications for the Ecat SKLep been done ?
    Is it necessary to explain the theory upon which the Ecat works to obtain the certification ?
    Best
    Jimbo

  • Steve

    I have seen a lot of very ambitious proposals for the ECat. Everyone seems, if even possible, too far fetched and in need of a lot of research and efforts. Perhaps the initial idea of a LED lamp powered by an ecat was on the right path. Do you think that a single ECat 100w can be combined with an electric byke battery. If it is feasible you will have your ‘Killer Application’ that could finance your next steps in developing the ecat.

  • Dear Dr. Rossi,

    To re-phrase my question, do you agree that you have confidence:
    1. That other manufacturers are unlikely to be make a cheaper product than yours any time soon? Because your product is efficiently designed?
    2. That the Public will chose a Rossi e-Cat based on your successful demo and development work? Because they will have trust that your product works?
    3. That your product patent can and will be globally enforced due to sufficient investor legal funds already on hand? Any imitators will be forced to pay you royalties?

    Therefore, we are likely to see many millions of e-Cat SKLeps produced when the customer orders are verified and accepted? Causing smiles on happy customers?

    I hope you agree.

    Best Regards,

    Daniel G. Zavela

  • Andrea Rossi

    Eernie1:
    Thank you for the suggestion,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Daniel G. Zavela:
    The reason why the investors of Leonardo Corporation need a proper income before reverse engineering is enforced is obvious.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Martin:
    Thank you for the suggestion,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Steven Nicholes Karels:
    Thank you for your suggestions,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Steven Nicholes Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    I suggest a different way of analyzing the use of Ecat SKLep technology with Electric Vehicles (EVs).

    In the US, the average commute is a one-way trip of 16 miles and a commute time of just under 30 minutes. The two-way daily commute would be 32 miles and 1 hour.

    In the US, the average residential electric energy consumption is 30 kW-hrs / day.

    Assumptions:

    1. A workday of 9 hours (8 hours plus 1 hour for lunch/breaks) + a 1 hour commute time = 10 hours per workday.
    2. Personal travel (shopping) of 2 hours per day – this leaves 12 hours per day with the vehicle being at the residence.
    3. An EV efficiency of 300 Wh/mi, yields about 10 kW-hrs of energy used in vehicle transport per day

    Therefore, the average residential and driving energy consumption is 40-kW-hrs per day.

    In 12 hours at the residence, this would require about 4 kW power production rate.

    If smart dual-direction energy stations were at the workplace (9 hours per day), the energy production rate drops to about 2 kW.

    Scenario: You leave your Tesla Model Y plugged into your residential dual-direction charging station while at your residence. You drive to work (30 minutes) and plug into the workplace dual-direction charging station assigned for your vehicle. After work, you drive home, perhaps do some shopping, and plug into your dual-direction charging station at your residence.

    If you go on long trips, you make use of the Tesla supercharging network while traveling. Plug into a dual-direction charging station at the motel/hotel where you remain overnight. Your account is credited with the electricity produced – logged under your Tesla car serial number.

    A 2 kW Ecat SKLep 100W system would cost about $5k USD, while a 4 kW system would cost about $10K USD.

    Assuming an average electric bill of $200 / month = $2,400 / year. Pay-off would occur within about 4 years.

    Assume tax credits would encourage businesses and residential owners to install such dual-direction devices.

    By comparison, an equivalent solar panel installation on a residential house might cost up to $50K USD.

    Thoughts?

  • Martin

    Dear readers,

    A concept of an eletric car, driven by an electric generator, which privedes a constant amount of electricity fed into a battery, exists.

    The former Audi-engeneer Roland Gumpert has developed a car, which uses a 15kW-methanol-fuel-cell, which is connected to a battery which drives the car.

    This car is called “Nathalie” and is availible (to buy or to lease). Gumpert has founded an own company to realize Nathalie:

    https://www.rolandgumpert.com/en/

    Now imagine to replace the methanol-Fuel cell with Ecat SKLeps (150 pieces in this case). This would be – in my opinion – the perfect concept.

    Dr. Rossi: In my opinion it would make sence to contact Mr. Gumpert. He seems to be very innovative and open for new ideas. And there is not that resistance against new concepts you can find in big companies…

    Best regards, Martin

  • Dear Dr. Rossi,

    The linkage of your requirement by your investors to sell 1 million units to hit your product price targets is understandable.

    Your concern about product re-engineering by others is a puzzle to me,
    1, Are you worried that other manufacturers can somehow make a cheaper product?
    2. That the Public will chose an Apple e-Cat or a GE e-Cat over a Rossi e-Cat and ignore your successful demo and development work?
    3. That your product patent can not be globally enforced due to a lack of legal funds?

    Perhaps you can tell us what is the reason product re-engineering concerns you?

    Best of luck with your sales effort.

    Best Regards,

    Daniel G. Zavela

  • eernie1

    Dear Andrea,
    Much criticism about the validity of OU devices has been that reproducibility of operation is sporadic. I think if you display a system in operation then replace it with two or three other systems operating in a similar fashion, you can convince many people of its validity. Perhaps this would aid you to reach your 1M objective.
    Convincing regards.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Steven Nicholes Karels:
    Thank you for your suggestions,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    LarryJ:
    Thank you for your assumptions and suggestion,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Steve Albers:
    The answer is complex, I prefer to keep it confidential.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Greetings Andrea,

    Just curious if there’s anything you can share about current efforts (such as demos to potential customers) to help get over the million order finish line?

  • LarryJ

    My assumptions

    I think you said that once you have a million orders and can start production that it would take you about 1 year to ramp up and fill those first million orders.

    I also assume if the ecat is seen by customers to work as promised that you would have a tsunami of new orders very quickly after starting deliveries. That would give you your million orders months before you would be in a position to fill them.

    1. Why not start production when you have maybe 750,000 vetted orders which might give you 9 or 10 months before you would need to receive the final 250,000 orders.

    Thanks
    LarryJ

  • Steven Nicholes Karels

    Dear Andrea Rossi,

    One more thing on electric vehicles (EVs). The energy stored in the EV could be used to pump energy back into the electrical grid if the charger is bi-directional. Tesla is considering this. So, if an EV is driven little and plugged in when not in use, then SKLep units in the vehicle could generate revenue for the owner using excess energy supplied to the electrical grid.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Michael:
    Sorry to contradict you, but to be ready to produce is not in contrast to consider premature the advertising, that obviously will start when we will be ready to deliver. Since we are not yet able to foresee when we will reach the target necessary to start the production, it is a logic consequence the fact that we consider premature to foresee when we will start the due advertising.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Steven Nicholes Karels

    Koen Vandewalle,

    Good points. A few issues:

    1. Each car does not need a Supercharger rate of 100kW. If an Electric Vehicle (EV) has a battery pack capacity of 60kW-hrs, and a charging period of 8 hours, then a charging rate of 8 kW is sufficient. 8 hours is how long most people work. 8 hours (or more) is how long people are at their residence and the EV could be charging during that time. 80 100W SKLep units would cost about $20k USD – although market pressures will likely drive the per kW cost down with time. Most people don’t drive 3 hours to work, so the vehicle charging rate need only be the amount of battery energy used per trip divided by the charging time. For example, if one commutes to work in one hour of driving time and consumes 36 kW-hrs of energy including the return trip, has 8 hours to charge while at work and 8 hours (or more) of charging when at his/her residence, then the needed charging rate is 36 kW-hrs / 16 hours or about 2kW. 2 kW could be provided by 20 Ecat SKLep 100W units at a cost of $5K USD.

    2. Hydrogen has its own problems – explosive when mixed with air, fire, metal embrittlement, storage.

    3. Propane has carbon which still produces CO2 when used, albeit cleaner than gasoline. Propane has storage issues (temperature and density – compared to gasoline).

    Perhaps the best solution is where home or other location Ecat SKLep units generate electricity 24/7 (continuously). Excess energy would flow back onto the electrical grid. Solar would help on Peak Demand hours. As AR says, an integrated energy approach is best.

  • Jan Šrajer

    Hi Koen Vandewalle
    One more note. Imagine a slogan at a car show: This electric car doesn’t need charging, it charges itself over the course of 11 years.

    With kind regards

    Jan

  • Michael

    Dear Mr. Rossi,

    I am a bit confused about your answers to Heinrich.
    Once you say that you are ready to produce as soon as the one million pre orders are reached.
    Then you say it is premature to advertise, to invide people for tests to your office ASO to reach the one million faster.

    These statements contradicts each other.
    I am more and more assailed by doubts that you want to start the production, what ever reasons you have.

    Nevertheless, best regards
    Michael

  • Jan Šrajer

    Hi Koen Vandewalle
    I think the opposite. Moreover, an electric car prototype for a large manufacturer is not a problem. When combining the E-catSKLep100W with a battery box, from the point of view of safety, it is necessary to comply with the condition not to overcharge the battery box above 4.2V per cell. Everything else is easier. 2 electric car prototypes can be tested within six months. For car manufacturers, this can be a boon as it will ensure their further development for many decades.
    Electric cars are already produced by all the big car manufacturers and they have a lot of money invested in them. Supplementing with E-catSKLep100W in a certain amount is the easiest way to rapidly develop electromobility.

    With kind regaŕds
    Jan

  • Koen Vandewalle

    Hi Steven N Karels,
    I share your opinion on technical safety when designing new collaborations between technologies from various manufacturers. Considering what measures are sometimes required when vehicles are recalled to the factory due to accidents with a technical cause, I don’t think any manufacturer of the current car models will provide a conversion kit for an E-Cat.

    The charging plug is always on the outside of the vehicle, not somewhere in the trunk. That has its reasons.
    It is also never possible to get directly to the battery from the trunk or anywhere under the hood in a simple way.

    So if EVs with E-Cat technology have to come onto the market, they will have to be installed in a controlled manner by the car manufacturers themselves. The best imaginable alternative is a mobile charging station that you can take with you in the vehicle, and which you have to place next to the parked vehicle for charging. 100 kWh/h is 1000 E-cats @ 250USD = 250,000 USD.

    The standards are often a result of lobbying inspired by powerful, established industries. Nevertheless, my experience is that every standard had at least one or more precedents of accidents or near misses. Set a DIY-E-Cat-EV combination on fire in the underground parking garage of a residential complex or shopping center: Insurance companies and their lawyers will know where to find the tinkerer.
    This week, an entire apartment building burned down in my area due to a malfunction of an electric bicycle.

    I think EVs will be much less widespread than what we’re used to with today’s internal combustion engine vehicles. This is for many different reasons.
    A better application is to use electricity to make hydrogen gas and syngas, from which all kinds of already known and commercialized products can be produced.

    If the E-Cat makes it possible to make propane or plastic at 4 to 5 € per kilogram, then I don’t see why electric cars should be built. Fuel manufacturers plan to achieve about 25% of their production this way by 2030, and 100% by 2050

    With kind regards,
    Koen

  • Andrea Rossi

    Frank Acland:
    Also,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Frank Acland

    Dear Andrea,

    In your current testing, is the Ecat SKLep operating according to the specifications posted on the pre-order forms you have published?

    Many thanks,

    Frank Acland

  • Dear Readers,
    For what it is worth, an engineers role is to take a discovery and make it work and a scientists role is to take the discovery and understand why it works. We need both types of people in this crazy world.

  • Steven Nicholes Karels

    Dear Fox and Lilylover,

    The posting I made was not addressed to Andrea Rossi but to the General Audience. The integration of eCat SKLep technology into a current, production Electric Vehicle (EV) can be achieved by a professional engineer with access to the electrical, mechanical, and software designs and interfaces of the EV. That said, it would be a very challenging task for a lay person to successfully and safely integrate Ecat SKLep technology into their production EV.

    Andrea Rossi (AR) kindly consents to answer our posts. He has even said that he may occasionally learn something from them.

    In the past, I have suggested through JONP possible applications of Ecat technologies. A new thought for an application is not a waste of AR’s time. Making the product work is very important. Almost as important as knowing in what fields it might be used. Electrical power generation is obvious. Other possible applications are hidden “gems” that might be of interest to him. Or, AR can ignore them.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Ron:
    Thank you for your attention to our work,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Heinrich:
    When the target will be reached we will start the production and the deliveries,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Andrea Rossi

    Jan Srajer:
    Thank you for your suggestion,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

  • Jan Šrajer

    Mr.Rossi
    I think that any large car manufacturer is able to provide testing of 2 electric car prototypes, equipped with E-catSKLep100W x appropriated number within six months of signing the contract between you and them.
    The condition, according to my layman’s electrician’s point of view, is that E-catSKLep100W in a certain number of pieces should be resistant to the introduction of external voltage to E-catSKLep100W and feedback current from the output to the input E-catSKLep100W. Everything else can be solved more simply. The legal condition will probably be more demanding.

    All the best J.Š.

  • Heinrich

    Dear Dr. Rossi,
    you wrote “premature” in answer to my questions.
    Does this mean that you are not ready to start the production, yet? Even when the 1 million pre-orders are achieved?
    Otherwise I do not understand why you do not take all steps now to get more pre-orders.
    In another answer you wrote it is one week to start the delivery if the one million is reached.

    I thought Leonardo wants to get the one million pre-order as soon as possible..
    Warm regards
    Heinrich

  • Fox

    Dear LilyLover – Steven Nicholas Karels and other readers.
    You’re wasting Andrea Rossi’s time. Andrea must be to deal only with the things that only he knows: development and improvement of E-Cat SKLEP devices and problems strictly connected to them.
    How to apply these devices to a car, a toaster or a heating system etc … or how to sell or advertise them are problems that millions of technicians can easily solve for him and for you. Therefore I suggest not to occupy Rossi’s precious time with these useless things. Focus on issues closely related to the e-Cat or information that you think would be useful to Rossi. Otherwise Rossi, rightly and kindly, will only reply with a “thank you for the suggestion” “cordial greetings” and the like

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